From: owner-can-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca (Cdn-Firearms Digest) To: cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Subject: Cdn-Firearms Digest V7 #249 Reply-To: cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Sender: owner-can-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Errors-To: owner-can-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Precedence: normal Cdn-Firearms Digest Tuesday, June 29 2004 Volume 07 : Number 249 In this issue: National Post Column: More guns mean more death Letter: The right to bear arms "Don't you think people would think before pulling the trigger?" said SURPRIZE, SURPRIZE: REGISTERING GUNS DOESN'T KEEP THEM OUT OF THE Re: Letter: The right to bear arms Blame CANADA! Re: Blame CANADA! Heads Up! Reloading restrictions in the works! Re: Heads Up! Reloading restrictions in the works! Post Election View China stockpiling massive fireworks arsenal Re: Kanadian values Your editorial in the CSSA June '04 Bulletin Re: Silver Lining Re: Post Election View Re: Silver Lining letter to paper(s) (unpub). Fear factor sinks Tories ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 29 Jun 2004 11:34:33 -0600 (CST) From: "Breitkreuz, Garry - Assistant 1" Subject: National Post Column: More guns mean more death PUBLICATION: National Post DATE: 2004.06.29 EDITION: National SECTION: Editorials PAGE: A21 BYLINE: Neil Boyd SOURCE: National Post NOTE: Neil Boyd is a professor in the School of Criminology atSimon Fraser University in Burnaby, B.C. - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- More guns mean more death - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- American gun advocates such as John R. Lott Jr., author of More Guns, Less Crime, would have us believe that encouraging citizens to carry guns is a good means of producing social safety (More Gun Control Isn't The Answer, John R. Lott Jr., June 15.) What we do know is that the United States, with as many guns as people, has rates of lethal violence comparable to conflict-ridden countries in the developing world. In fact, the United States alone has more gun murders than 26 other industrialized countries combined. In 2002, it had 10,800 gun homicides (3.6 per 100,000). Canada had 149 (0.54 per 100,000), Great Britain had 80 (0.12 per 100,000), and Australia had 48 (0.31 per 100,000), hardly an indication that more guns produce less crime. While it is true that reported rates of some kinds of violent crime (robberies and assaults) are higher in other countries than they are in the United States, none of us can compare to our southern neighbour, in terms of its rates of lethal violence. Claims that violence has increased with stronger gun controls are just wrong. The Australian Institute of Criminology released a report in January, 2004, analyzing the trends in firearms violence over the past decade. Firearms crime has fallen significantly and overall homicides fell 25% between 1995/6 and 2002/3. Between 1993 and 2001 firearm robberies decreased by 15%. In Britain, the Home Office reported that in the year ending March 31, 2002, there was a 16% reduction in homicides involving firearms and a 13% reduction in robberies involving firearms. But perceptions of crime are shaped by media coverage. It is often argued that because the percentage of murders with handguns has increased, gun control clearly doesn't work. A closer look at the Canadian data reveals what is actually happening. Murders with handguns have increased somewhat; murders with rifles and shotguns have plummeted. As a consequence, overall gun deaths are down. In the four years between 1989 and 1992 there was an annual average of 233 gun murders -- 97 with handguns and 106 with rifles and shotguns. In the four years between 1999 and 2002 there was an annual average of 167 gun murders -- 101 with handguns and 66 with rifles and shotguns. The percentage of firearms murders committed with handguns has increased (from less than 50% in the early '90s to more than 60% today) but how can anyone actually argue that we are worse off today with an average of 167 gun murders than we were a decade ago with an average of 233? In Canada, 1977, 1991 and 1995 legislation strengthened controls on rifles and shotguns and we see substantial declines in their misuse with this progressive tightening, in spite of population increases. In 1991 there were 1,444 gun deaths (including homicides, suicides and accidents) and in 2001, the last year for which there are data, there were 842. The notion that gun control has made us less safe is not supported by the best available research. No right to own guns exists under international law. The United Nations Special Rapporteur on Human Rights has written that states which fail to enact reasonable regulations to limit the availability and misuse of firearms may be failing to meet their obligations under international law. Canada's current approach to gun control is scarcely deviant; it is similar to what is seen in most industrialized countries. In spite of the U.S. gun lobby rhetoric, gun control is an investment that is paying off in public safety. If it were true that more guns produced less crime, America would be the safest country in the world -- an annual toll of almost 11,000 firearms homicides tells a different story. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jun 2004 11:35:07 -0600 (CST) From: "Breitkreuz, Garry - Assistant 1" Subject: Letter: The right to bear arms PUBLICATION: National Post DATE: 2004.06.29 EDITION: National SECTION: Editorials PAGE: A21 BYLINE: Bruce N. Mills SOURCE: National Post - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The right to bear arms - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- There is a common misbelief that the right to keep and bear arms is only to be found in the United States. This is the gun grabbers' Big Lie, which, if they repeat it often enough, they hope will somehow become true. Nothing could be further from the truth, for it is enshrined throughout English and Canadian history and law. The right to keep and bear arms did not spring from the the U.S. founding fathers; they derived it from the same sources as do we: the Magna Carta, 1215; the English Bill of Rights, 1689; the philosophy of John Locke in his 1690 Two Treatises on Government; and the writings of one of England's premier jurists, Sir William Blackstone, in his Commentaries on English Law, 1765. Bruce N. Mills, Dundas, Ont. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jun 2004 11:35:39 -0600 (CST) From: "Breitkreuz, Garry - Assistant 1" Subject: "Don't you think people would think before pulling the trigger?" said PUBLICATION: The Edmonton Sun DATE: 2004.06.29 EDITION: Final SECTION: News PAGE: 18 BYLINE: DAN PALMER AND RAQUEL EXNER, EDMONTON SUN - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- SHOOTING VICTIM 'LEERY OF THINGS' ASSAILANTS SENTENCED IN THORSBY-AREA INCIDENT - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- A 65-year-old farmer who, along with his wife, came under shotgun fire while driving into their yard in 2001, says capital punishment should be brought back to deter crime. "There's no guarantee, but there's a good chance it might have (prevented our ordeal)," Ed Zukowski said yesterday, after a judge in a Wetaskiwin court sentenced two men to nine years for the December 2001 shooting. "Don't you think people would think before pulling the trigger?" said Zukowski. Christopher Cain, 25, and Michael O'Bee, 24, each got nine years in prison yesterday, but were given credit for time spent in pre-trial custody. That reduced the sentences to five years each. Both men also got a lifetime firearms prohibition and must submit a DNA sample to the national data bank. Zukowski said the sentences are too soft. "It's way too lenient," said Zukowski. "They should've got 25 years with no parole." The men were sentenced on two counts each of discharging a firearm with intent to wound, maim, or disfigure, and one count of break and enter. Cain's sentence also covered a single count of possession of a shotgun while prohibited. In March, the pair were found guilty of those charges. Cain and O'Bee were to be retried on two counts each of attempted murder, but the Crown stayed the charges. A jury this spring failed to reach a verdict on the charges. Patricia and Ed Zukowski were both hit in the face by the shotgun blasts as they pulled into the driveway of their home near Thorsby, 70 km southwest of Edmonton. Cain and O'Bee were arrested the following June after bragging about the shooting to undercover cops. Zukowski said since the shooting, he hasn't felt the same and he's now more "leery of things," pointing out he's more "alert" and reacts more to sounds on the farm than before. "I just don't feel the same as I did before," he said. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jun 2004 11:36:00 -0600 (CST) From: "Breitkreuz, Garry - Assistant 1" Subject: SURPRIZE, SURPRIZE: REGISTERING GUNS DOESN'T KEEP THEM OUT OF THE SURPRIZE, SURPRIZE: REGISTERING GUNS DOESN'T KEEP THEM OUT OF THE HANDS OF CRIMINALS By Garry Breitkreuz, MP - June 22, 2004 http://www.garrybreitkreuz.com/publications/Article403.htm ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jun 2004 11:51:34 -0600 (CST) From: Bruce Mills Subject: Re: Letter: The right to bear arms "Breitkreuz, Garry - Assistant 1" wrote: > > PUBLICATION: National Post > DATE: 2004.06.29 > EDITION: National > SECTION: Editorials > PAGE: A21 > BYLINE: Bruce N. Mills > SOURCE: National Post > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > The right to bear arms > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > There is a common misbelief that the right to keep and bear arms is only to be > found in the United States. This is the gun grabbers' Big Lie, which, if they > repeat it often enough, they hope will somehow become true. Nothing could be > further from the truth, for it is enshrined throughout English and Canadian > history and law. > > The right to keep and bear arms did not spring from the the U.S. founding > fathers; they derived it from the same sources as do we: the Magna Carta, 1215; > the English Bill of Rights, 1689; the philosophy of John Locke in his 1690 Two > Treatises on Government; and the writings of one of England's premier jurists, > Sir William Blackstone, in his Commentaries on English Law, 1765. > > Bruce N. Mills, Dundas, Ont. This was heavily "redacted" from my original: - -------- Original Message -------- Subject: Re: Ward Eagen's letter Date: Sun, 27 Jun 2004 17:20:00 -0400 From: Bruce Mills To: Editor - National Post Mr. Eagen's mathematical and philosophical shortcomings aside, there is one point in particular that he made that I would like to address: his belief that the right to keep and bear arms is only to be found in the United States. This, of course, is the gun grabber's Big Lie, which, if they repeat it often enough, they hope will somehow become true. Nothing could be further from the truth. Not only is the right to keep and bear arms the sovereign right of the individual, it is also enshrined throughout English and Canadian history and law. The right to keep and bear arms did not spring full-born from the foreheads of the American Founding Fathers; they derived it from the same source as do we: the Magna Carta 1215, the English Bill of Rights 1689, the philosophy of John Locke in his Treatises on Government 1690, the writings of one of England's premier jurists, Sir William Blackstone in his Commentaries on English Law 1765, all the way to the British North America Act 1867, the Canadian Bill of Rights 1960, and our Canadian Constitution and Charter of Rights and Freedoms 1982. While the ideological anti-gun policies of the Federal Lieberal Government has imposed severe restrictions on this right, R v Sparrow (SCC) shows that a right cannot be regulated out of existence - it must specifically be extinguished. Which, to the best of my knowledge, it has not. The Conservatives do not have a "hidden agenda" to dismantle "gun control" in Canada - they are very frank and up front about doing so: it's in their Party platform. Which is as it should be for anyone who loves and respects freedom and the rights of the individual. Which Eagan and his gun-grabbing buddies obviously do not. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jun 2004 12:35:33 -0600 (CST) From: Charles Stansfield Subject: Blame CANADA! Yes, the song from the movie, "South Park" is partially right: BLAME CANADA for the results of last night's sorry election results that returned a Liberal minority, that will be propped up by the left wing of the Liberal Party, the NDP. Blame Canada because most Canadians, it seems, would rather be raped by someone they *know* is a rapist, than by someone that hasn't raped them. Of course, the one that HAS raped them is whispering, "he might rape you even worse!" into the ear of the electorate. I'm sick and tired of the play-it-safe neo-United Empire Loyalist mentality which never wants to take a chance on the FUTURE. And I do indeed blame Canada for not having the guts to throw off tyranny, because they're afraid that an unknown situation might constitute an *unknown* tyranny. HOW MUCH WORSE COULD IT FRIGGIN' GET??? We just re-elected THIEVES, folks! Stupid shites. And you're dragging the rest of us down with you. Disgustedly, Charles Stansfield ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jun 2004 12:38:55 -0600 (CST) From: Bruce Mills Subject: Re: Blame CANADA! Charles Stansfield wrote: > I'm sick and tired of the play-it-safe neo-United Empire Loyalist mentality > which never wants to take a chance on the FUTURE. Pardon me, but I *AM* a United Empire Loyalist, nothing "neo" about it, and I take exception to your own narrow minded mentality. Yours in Liberty, Bruce Hamilton Ontario ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jun 2004 12:56:57 -0600 (CST) From: Bruce Mills Subject: Heads Up! Reloading restrictions in the works! Discussion from the Canadian Gun Nutz bulletin board: http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/viewtopic.php?p=128466#128466 The lastest CSSA newsletter is warning that the assholes at Natural Resources are out to avenge their defeat over the inexplosive components issue. The new proposals include some serious shit that will effectively shutdown reloading in most urban areas, pretty scary stuff. Time to go after your MP. even if he is a Lieberal or commie NDP and let them know that unelected officials should not be making laws. === This is what I got from my freind (in Natural Resources): With regards to the reloading issues, indeed that is our office that is lead on that under Explosives Act, no ban just tighter regs that will make it almost impossible to abide by. I am against the new proposals as a hunter and rep of the sport, I try my best to help the Cdn public. There will be a consultation process to review the recommendations and if you are interested, I will let you know when it comes out. For info our website is www.nrcan.gc.ca/mms/explosif you can find further info there. === Will try to keep you posted. Yours in Liberty, Bruce Hamilton Ontario ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jun 2004 13:03:09 -0600 (CST) From: Bruce Mills Subject: Re: Heads Up! Reloading restrictions in the works! Bruce Mills wrote: > There will be a consultation > process to review the recommendations and if you are interested, I will let you > know when it comes out. The "consultation" will probably be both a "public input" consultation and submissions before the appropriate Parliamentary Committee, when it comes to examining any regulations. No doubt this is yet another move to "implement by statute" the provisions of the "Organization of American States Inter-American Convention Against the Illicit Manufacturing of and Trafficking in Firearms, Ammunition, Explosives, and Other Related Materials as it relates to explosives and ammunition". This is sandbagging by treaty: some Foereign Affairs knob "negotiates" a treaty, in which we have no say, which we sign, that strips away some right they'd never dare introduce into the House on their own. Since treaties are binding, and even supercede the Constitution, they point to it and say "Hey, we have no choice!". Fucking assholes. Yours in Liberty, Bruce Hamilton Ontario ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jun 2004 13:18:00 -0600 (CST) From: "Todd Birch" Subject: Post Election View Well, once again we see the old adage prove true - As Ontario votes, so goes the country. It was obviously a rural/urban split outside of Toronto. We sure tried hard in the west and I am really surprised and disappointed that "Landslide Annie" pulled the bunny out of the hat once again. Look for an unholy alliance between the NDP and the Liberals as proven by the election of ex-NDP Premier Ujjahl Dosanjh. Birds of a feather. Not all of the Liberal handpicked candidates were so lucky. The real winers were the Bloc, NDP and the Greens who won enough votes to qualify for federal money to fund their next campaign. I'm gearing up for the next election already. Out here we felt that Harper was taking it a bit for granted with the western vote in his concentration on winning eastern voters. That was a mistake and may have lost a couple of seats. Take a breath and get ready for the next round. The battle is over but the war is still ongoing. Todd Birch ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jun 2004 13:32:42 -0600 (CST) From: "Breitkreuz, Garry - Assistant 1" Subject: China stockpiling massive fireworks arsenal China stockpiling massive fireworks arsenal Posted Tuesday, June 22, 2004 http://www.news.vu/en/living/8_11/china-stockpiling-massive.shtml ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jun 2004 13:34:28 -0600 (CST) From: "John E. Stevens" Subject: Re: Kanadian values At 01:24 PM 6/29/2004, you wrote: >I feel pretty cynical about politics here too, Boris. > >I like the Libertarians too, but we didn't have one running here in >Kingston, Ontario. We had 8 candidates, the top one on the ballot being >Rosie the Clown. >(Hey! I'm not making this up, see http://www.rosietheclown.ca ) > >Today's paper indicates that Rosie got 83 votes. I might as well have made >it 84. And so, next time in our frustration we all vote libertarian or Rosie or whoever we think might be a good "protest" vote...........and just split up the votes even more. With that approach we may just as well melt 'em down now and go fishing. An interesting statistic would be to know just how many liberals got in with less than a 200 vote majority. That's something to think about and aim at. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jun 2004 13:44:18 -0600 (CST) From: "C. Dillabough" Subject: Your editorial in the CSSA June '04 Bulletin > Hello Jim, > > It is good news to read your guest editorial in the CSSA newspaper. The > fact that the NFA, CSSA, and CILA are working together to fight the > issue of restricted magazine capacity is a great starting point for > future cooperative efforts. The time for cooperation such as this among > the multitude of firearm organizations in Canada is something that is > way overdue. > > The NFA, CSSA, and CILA each bring a benefit through past specialization > to the table. It is time all firearm owners and shooting disclipines > come together to fight the common enemy we face. I think we can all > agree that we have taken enough beating for a lifetime? > > This issue is something that I first preached on the Digest several > years ago. It reminds me of my efforts to bring the Progressive > Conservative and Reform parties together since '96. Back then it seemed > like I was preaching in the darkness, but I guess time changes > everything. We have seen the political right unite, and now the > beginnings of unity among firearms organizations is taking shape. > > All I can say is "thanks guys" and don't let this initiative stop now. > We need to include ALL firearms organizations into one formidable > Lieberal foe! If this comes to pass, the next federal election may take > on a very different outcome than what we saw yesterday. At least we > booted out one Lieberal MP here in our eastern Ontario riding of > Stormont-Dundas-South Glengarry. > > Regards, > Charles Dillabough, CGA > > PS. Would you please pass along this letter to Larry Whitmore and Tony > Bernardo as I do not have their emails. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jun 2004 15:21:22 -0600 (CST) From: "jim davies" Subject: Re: Silver Lining > Oscar Lacombe has already begun a personal prosecution against Link > Byfield in Edmonton... ???????????????????????? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jun 2004 15:21:55 -0600 (CST) From: "jim davies" Subject: Re: Post Election View > Out here we felt that Harper was taking it a bit for granted with the > western vote in his concentration on winning eastern voters. That was a > mistake and may have lost a couple of seats. Disagree on that. He was carrying the message to the unwashed. Our job was to keep the home fires burning, not to whine for some attention. I rrealize you are talking about swing voters in the west, not yourself and others. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jun 2004 15:31:10 -0600 (CST) From: Bruce Mills Subject: Re: Silver Lining jim davies wrote: > > > Oscar Lacombe has already begun a personal prosecution against Link > > Byfield in Edmonton... > > ???????????????????????? While it is usually the Cops and Crown that lays an "information" before the Courts, anyone may do the same. It then goes before a Judge to determine whether the case has enough merit to proceed. Since the Provincial AGs and SolGens won't lay charges against Eduardo & Co., it is up to us to do it ourselves. It's the only way to get a case before the Courts for a Charter Challenge. Yours in Liberty, Bruce Hamilton Ontario ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jun 2004 15:31:37 -0600 (CST) From: "Robert S. Sciuk" Subject: letter to paper(s) (unpub). Dear Sir/Madame, Congratulations to Mr. Martin and his undeserving band of thieves in retaining some semblance of power with a minority government. Congratulations as well to the buttheads both in the Maritimes and particularly those in the Greater Toronto area for re-electing them. Canadians have once again proven that democracy is all about getting the quality of government we deserve and this is certainly just what Canadian voters deserve. While I'm sure that the election result will make no difference to Liberal arrogance in the long run, short term at least Mr. Martin had better cozy up to Mr. Layton, and start figuring out how to keep the ill-fated honeymoon alive as long as possible -- or at least long enough to get the summer holidays behind us without another federal election. If Mr. Martin is wondering about where to start with his legislative slate, look no further than trying to get to the bottom of who was responsible for the ADSCAM debacle, and bringing those criminals to justice! Oh, yeah, Adscam ... we almost forgot -- you wish! Sincerely, Robert S. Sciuk Oshawa, Ont. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 29 Jun 2004 15:37:03 -0600 (CST) From: Bruce Mills Subject: Fear factor sinks Tories http://www.canoe.ca/NewsStand/OttawaSun/News/2004/06/29/518093.html June 29, 2004 The Ottawa Sun Fear factor sinks Tories By MARIA McCLINTOCK, Parliamentary Bureau CALGARY -- Conservative Leader Stephen Harper's hopes for a minority government slipped through his fingers last night -- evidence he failed to capitalize on the $250-million sponsorship scandal and convince voters it was time to dump the Liberals. The election result was also an indication Canadians weren't ready to put their faith in the newly merged Conservative Party, and that the Liberal attack ads that painted Harper as pro-war and anti-choice succeeded. Voter-rich Ontario remained elusive to the Conservatives, which at press time had managed to win only 21 seats in the country's most populous province. Conservative candidates and supporters who gathered in the Calgary Stampede Roundup Centre booed loudly when national TV networks declared the Liberals securing a minority government 20 minutes after the polls closed. A shocked silence fell over the room as disillusioned supporters watched the Liberals take the lead. ELUSIVE ONTARIO "I think the Liberal distortion of our platform did have quite an impact, especially because we were such a new organization," said Calgary Conservative MP Diane Ablonczy. Long-time Conservative strategist Rod Love admitted the Grits were able to convince Ontarians that Harper was a scary guy with a hidden agenda. "I am surprised. Fear works. Paul Martin promised Canadians a campaign of ideas. We got a campaign of fear and it worked," Love said. Harper told supporters in Calgary that he'll take the defeat in stride. "I will admit that I feel some disappointment tonight, but you should feel none... We deprived the Liberals of the majority they thought they were entitled to." Harper also signalled he will not try to bring down the fragile government. "Canada has known minority governments before and at all times Canadians expect and deserve stability and certainty and we as an opposition will act accordingly," he said. ------------------------------ End of Cdn-Firearms Digest V7 #249 ********************************** Submissions: mailto:cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Mailing List Commands: mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Moderator's e-mail address: mailto:moderator@hitchen.org List owner: mailto:owner-cdn-firearms@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca FAQ list: http://www.magma.ca/~asd/cfd-faq1.html and http://teapot.usask.ca/cdn-firearms/Faq/cfd-faq1.html Web Site: http://teapot.usask.ca/cdn-firearms/homepage.html FTP Site: ftp://teapot.usask.ca/pub/cdn-firearms/ CFDigest Archives: http://www.sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca/~ab133/ or put the next command in an e-mail message and mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca get cdn-firearms-digest v04.n192 end (192 is the digest issue number and 04 is the volume) To unsubscribe from _all_ the lists, put the next five lines in a message and mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca unsubscribe cdn-firearms-digest unsubscribe cdn-firearms-alert unsubscribe cdn-firearms-chat unsubscribe cdn-firearms end (To subscribe, use "subscribe" instead of "unsubscribe".) If you find this service valuable, please consider making a tax-deductible donation to the freenet we use: Saskatoon Free-Net Assoc., P.O. Box 1342, Saskatoon SK S7K 3N9 Phone: (306) 382-7070 Home page: http://www.sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca/ These e-mail digests are free to everyone, and are made possible by the efforts of countless volunteers. Permission is granted to copy and distribute this digest as long as it not altered in any way.