From: owner-can-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca (Cdn-Firearms Digest) To: cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Subject: Cdn-Firearms Digest V5 #7 Reply-To: cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Sender: owner-can-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Errors-To: owner-can-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Precedence: normal Cdn-Firearms Digest Friday, August 30 2002 Volume 05 : Number 007 In this issue: Analogous to the fight with the CFC Your Privacy Re: Support the NFA! Re: Support the NFA! Boy who shot senior gets Disney vacation Re: Good Lawyers Police defend pepper-spray attack on senior Blue MAX National Post 2002 08 30 CTV: Traffic accidents claiming more lives worldwide re: Unsolicited Letter from RFC Kingston VictTC: Ottawa looks for ways to intercept e-mails ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 12:39:19 -0600 (CST) From: "Richard A. Fritze" Subject: Analogous to the fight with the CFC Lame ducks must be shown the door Diane Francis Financial Post Thursday, August 29, 2002 ADVERTISEMENT Canada's political Mediocracy rolls along with its two oldest, and least popular, leaders announcing they will resign. But not immediately. Prime Minister Jean ChrÈtien last week said he'll go in February, 2004, thus avoiding a test of his leadership this February. And weeks ago, Tory leader Joe Clark said he'll eventually go, thus avoiding a test of his leadership this week. This is unacceptable. It's equivalent to an unpopular CEO announcing he will eventually, perhaps 18 months hence, resign but won't hold the annual general meeting, to avoid a test of his leadership. Where are the party officials in all of this? Why would they allow this to occur? Both parties should not have allowed these announcements to avert leadership tests and both men should have given two months' notice so that successors could compete for their jobs. Mr. Clark's continuation as Tory leader is the single biggest impediment to democracy in Canada. He has steadfastly stood in the way of a conservative coalition to give voters a federal choice. But far worse, is a lingering Prime Minister who has far too much power already. In this case, Mr. ChrÈtien has granted himself a virtual 18-month dictatorship by muzzling his Cabinet ministers and threatening them with dismissal if they so much as organize any plan to succeed him. So for the next 18 months he has cunningly enhanced his control over his Cabinet. It is also unacceptable to delay departure by 18 months because that's a long time. In terms of world events, or economic ones, huge shifts can occur within such a period. Critical decisions, affecting Canada for a long time, could be required. For instance, within the next 18 months it's likely that the United States may ask Canada and other nations to help invade Iraq. How can Canadians be forced to rely on a lame duck with a hobbled Cabinet to make such a critical choice? Also during this time, the Middle East may truly fall apart, whether we're in Iraq or not. What then? A near-retiree calling the shots for 31 million people? There are also other critical issues ahead. There's pressure by ignorant civil servants and environmentalists to sign the Kyoto Treaty, or something like it, which could ruin Canada's economic future . And what about the Prime Minister's proclivity to loot the nation's treasury by pouring money into his riding and into Quebec? (Lest we forget more money went into his riding for a couple of years than went to Alberta as a whole.) Without an election looming, how many hotels, four-lane highways, hockey arenas and grants to dying businesses in Shawinigan and Quebec will we taxpayers be forced to pay for? Then there are the patronage appointments over the next year and a half. All kinds of jobs will be handed out by the PMO which may be more about paying off favours or setting up future benefits than about finding the right persons for the tasks. As Pierre Trudeau showed, with his disgraceful exit list containing a couple of dozen shameless appointments, cronyism can hobble a nation for decades. And it can also sandbag any successor, no matter how popular. Perhaps most dangerous to taxpayers of all is the "legacy" thing. Just how much of our money is going to go where Mr. ChrÈtien's mouth is? Already, trial balloons have been raised about an enormous hike in "social" spending. What does this mean? Does the Prime Minister want a chain of ChrÈtien Day Care Centres from coast to coast at an unaffordable cost? Or will it be throwing billions into subsidized housing that municipal taxpayers will pay for forever, but not have a chance to approve? Whatever happens, these resignations-in-waiting do illustrate the wisdom of term limits and fixed terms and some form of checks and balances over appointments and expenditures. For starters, these two, and others, should have been forced to retire after eight years, and then duly turned out to the speaking circuit pasture. Instead, they afflict the nation --two tired men who have been around too long and haven't had a brainstorm between them in a decade. They are custodial, and now clearly controlling, and want it all their way. And they are damn well determined to get it all ... including setting the exact date when they will be terminated. © Copyright 2002 National Post ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 12:42:05 -0600 (CST) From: Vulcun1isback@aol.com Subject: Your Privacy For what it's worth- I wrote the Privacy Commissionaire to complain about the Justice Department's privitization of the Firearm Licencing system. I stated that I felt that the government had broken the law under the Privacy act,by handing over my private information to a Private company without my express consent. I further wrote that I was deeply concerned over security issues that could stem from such Privitization. Just think, We have no way of knowing who works for this company,nor their hiring/screening Practices. For all we know this company could employ ex-cons which would give them access to info on the addresses of firearms owners-hence create a criminals wish list. - -Although this is pure speculation on my part, I can see foresee it possibly happening knowing the sloppy record this government has -and besides if ity did happen the government would smugly claim that because it is a private firm they have no control over how they operate or who they hire. - - I don't expect a whole lot of cooperation from the Privacy Commissionaires office after all- it is a federal position as well- created for "feel-good politics" .. We all know that there is and never was any real Privacy in Canada. - - But for what it's worth- I felt that I (and gun owners in general I believe) should lodge a formal complaint about the handing over of Private Information without our consent. Perhaps Richard or Calvin can advise us if this would be grounds for a Class-action lawsuit from the RFC ? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 12:45:04 -0600 (CST) From: "DJ MacIntyre" Subject: Re: Support the NFA! >This is the fallacy of the collective - that if you simply "join" an >organization, you are actually "accomplishing" something of great import. >It's the "other guy" syndrome - you pay "the other > guy" to fight your fight for you. Well, see, that's *exactly* the way it is. The NFA executive *are* "paid" to do the job for me, either monetarily, or through title and authority. And I feel it's the job of the NFA provincial presidents and field officers to "tap" promising individuals for assistance/field officer-hood if *they* need help fighting *our* fight. Otherwise, I assume they just need my financial assistance. I do *not* do charity work, and I do not tilt at windmills without good reason ;-). >DJ, I want to ask you something in all sincerity, and I don't mean to >humiliate you or otherwise demean you; it is for >informational purposes only. And I will reply in kind. And fear not demeaning or humiliating me ;-). I judge my self-worth by far bigger yardsticks than what faceless net entities might say about me ;-). >DJ, what are *you* doing to fight C-68 and/or promote the shooting sports? What do I do? Here's what I do: I tell anyone I know, any gun owner/collector/enthusiast, when I can get the conversation into that vein (and with me, it always ends up in that vein ;-), about the current state of the law as I understand it and have had it explained to me, and what they should be doing to first comply, then understand the intracacies. As for promoting the shooting sports, I do not participate, so I cannot promote it. However, I am soon to get my restricted PAL, and at that time, I probably will start there, as well. I *am* a hunter, bow, rifle, and shotgun. I do very strongly promote hunting, in an intelligent, and thoughtful manner. I *always* bring well labelled game dishes to work pot-luck dinners, and staff get-togethers. And, as a rule, I always bring home damn-near licked clean platters. I have been personally responsible for several individual and family NFA memberships. And I am personally responsible for the creation of three hunters, perhaps four, as well as helping to train many, and have assisted more than a dozen people negotiate the labrynth that is the firearms-to-hunting permit system, including some foreigners wishing to either emigrate, or just visit and hunt. I also participate in many of the usenet forums wrt hunting and firearms, as well as several private email lists in that same theme. >Do you think it's enough? Do you want to do more? Do you want to >be all that you can be? :-} I think that is well above average, actually. I am willing to do more, but again, my time is valuable, especially to me. I *have* taken up crosses before, but find that Mary Magdalene was a "one-off", more times than not ;-). >If you do, I have something I want to send to you for your perusal. I am, of course, Bruce, willing to do you the favor of reading anything you send, as I, myself, was born on "The Mountain" in ole Hamilton. Fire away ;-). DJ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 12:49:00 -0600 (CST) From: Edward Hudson Subject: Re: Support the NFA! Bruce Mills wrote: {{snipped fore and aft}} > This is the fallacy of the collective - that if you simply "join" an > organization, you are actually "accomplishing" something of great import. It's > the "other guy" syndrome - you pay "the other guy" to fight your fight for you. > This is the problem with *every* top-down, structured hierarchy - too many > Chiefs and not enough Indians. This is one fight that you can (not {sic}) pay > some other guy to win for you. Well said, (with the addition of an inadvertently omitted NOT). We can NOT pay someone else to fight this fight for us. I hope everyone uses this Labor Day weekend to consider their own personal involvement in this fight against the Firearms Act. To win, we must have the commitment of as many people as possible. But to say that "everyone" must be involved is also a fallacy. I think we can win this fight with 10% of the firearms owners actively involved. Each person must decide whether they are going to be an active participant in the greatest fight of our lives, or just a spectator sitting contentedly on their butts in the stands watching someone else fighting in the arena. This is not a fight for the faint of heart. Peaceful, non-violent involvement to correct a great wrong is going to take TOTAL commitment of one's mind, soul, and body. We will be tested to the MAX !! Enjoy Opening Day of Duck Season and return refreshed and committed to making a difference in Canada. It is our Liberty we are fighting to reclaim. Sincerely, Eduardo - -- "Never doubt that a small group of committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has." Margaret Mead ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 12:52:48 -0600 (CST) From: "Jay Callaghan" Subject: Boy who shot senior gets Disney vacation SOURCE: Edmonton Sun DATE: August 30, 2002 BYLINE: CP OTTAWA -- A boy who shot and critically wounded his 64-year-old neighbour has been picked by Quebec social workers to go to Walt Disney World. The boy, from Maniwaki, Que., and 12 other children chosen by the Outaouais (west Quebec) region's Youth Protection Services will fly to the Florida theme park Sept. 18. The all-expenses-paid trip is being organized by Fondation Reve - Dream Foundation, which asks children's agencies to choose underprivileged children to send on vacation. Luc Cadieux, director of youth protection for the Outaouais, said the boy fits the selection criteria: candidates must be between six and nine years old, from a family of humble means, and must never have been to a Disney-owned theme park. The boy, who cannot be named by law, was eight when he loaded a big-game rifle on Nov. 25, 2000, went into the woods where Jean-Guy Roy was chopping wood, and shot him at close range. The victim's son is angry that the boy has been chosen. "What kind of message is this sending to the rest of the kids?" said Marc Roy, a police officer in St-Jerome, Que. "We just feel that it's unacceptable." But Cadieux says the boy has been well-behaved over the past year and deserves the chance to learn from a positive experience. "I can understand it's not easy for Mr. Roy's family, but we have to look forward," he said. Despite the boy's statements to police that he was angry at Roy and intended to shoot him, Quebec child welfare officials concluded it was an accident. He could not be charged because he was under 12. Roy was in a coma for more than a month and was blinded and partially paralysed. He spent more than seven months in hospitals and now needs round-the-clock care. The boy's father pleaded guilty to negligent storage of a firearm, was fined, given 18 months probation and banned from owning firearms for the next eight years. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 12:54:00 -0600 (CST) From: Edward Hudson Subject: Re: Good Lawyers Robert LaCasse wrote: > The only good "down to earth" Lawyer you'll get, is one that is or has > been in the same predicament as you are in, or owns firearms himself,>> Thanks for all the recommendations. Nice to know so many qualified attorneys who understand our situation are available. Lots of interviews to be done. We don't want to beat this law on "technicalities", we want to repeal this law on "principle". An unjust law which violates our most basic, fundamental Right to self defense should be purged from the "law of the land". No one with a iota a self respect should ever consider submitting to this law. No one should consider registering a firearm. As someone said, purchase your cosmoline before the price rises. But save your Confederate money, boys (and Ladies); once we get lawyers involved we are going to need BIG BUCKS. Contrary to what Bruce & I said earlier, this is going to be an area where you can "pay your way" as we go along. We are going to need LOTS of money to fund a national coordinating center, and we are going to need even MORE money to pay the lawyers who fight the government to the Supreme Court multiple times. Sincerely, Eduardo ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 12:55:01 -0600 (CST) From: "Jay Callaghan" Subject: Police defend pepper-spray attack on senior SOURCE: Edmonton Sun DATE: August 30, 2002 BYLINE: AP LAKELAND, Florida -- Police said they shot an 81-year-old nursing home resident three times with bean bags and hit him with pepper spray when he became suicidal and brandished a small glass vase. Willie Foster, who was in a wheelchair and has a pacemaker, was holding the vase over his head and threatening the nursing home staff and police officers, a report of the incident said. "It was the safest option for the patients and the man," said police spokesman Jack Gillen. "If this were my parent, I would be satisfied with the officers' actions." Foster was reported in good condition at Lakeland Regional Medical Center. Foster's daughter, Felicia Kennedy, said police and nursing home officials acted improperly in the incident Tuesday night at Grace Healthcare. "He's 81 with a pacemaker and has a little bit of dementia," said Kennedy. She said her father was bruised by the bean bags. "I don't know if they even needed to call police. I wish they had called me first." ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 12:56:30 -0600 (CST) From: Robert LaCasse Subject: Blue MAX Correct me if I'm wrong, but weren't the RCMP Colors derived from the Blue MAX with the 4 Golden Eagles! The Red Band of the Local Police Departments reeks of KGB...Right? The British Police have a checkered Band Cap, looks like Taliban/Al queda Stuff...etc. I always thought it was! ThanX Bob Triad Productions-Fantalla(tm)~EZine~Para-Novel WEB>>> http://home.istar.ca/~vampire/index.htm BBS>255-8787> 1 Ring/Hangup/Wait 20 sec/ReCall. COM> Voice/Fax/Mail/Data> (604) 974-0998 x 1345 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 12:57:18 -0600 (CST) From: "Richard A. Fritze" Subject: National Post 2002 08 30 OTTAWA - A boy who intentionally shot and wounded his 64-year-old neighbour with a big-game rifle has been picked by Quebec social workers to go on a trip to Walt Disney World. A spokesman for Foundation Rêve-Dream Foundation, who is organizing the all-expenses- paid trip for underprivileged children, said the boy meets the criteria. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 13:07:37 -0600 (CST) From: The Jordans Subject: CTV: Traffic accidents claiming more lives worldwide Well gee whiz!!! 'They' say that firearms owners need to be licensed, and firearms need to be registered, JUST LIKE DRIVERS AND CARS, "in order to save lives"... Seems to me the cars and drivers scenario doesn't work any better than the firearms and owners does. Seems to me that more attention should be paid to the "world's biggest killers" (ie CARS), than to a personal possession that causes extremely FEW deaths in comparison. WHEN will they get their PRIORITIES straight? Linda = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Traffic accidents claiming more lives worldwide Fri. Aug. 30 2002 Associated Press GENEVA — Traffic accidents are set to become one of the world's biggest killers in the next two decades, with pedestrians making up the largest number of victims, the leader of a UN-sponsored research body said. Such accidents are currently the ninth leading cause of death globally, Dr. Adnan Hyder, a founding member of the Road Traffic Injury Research Network, said Wednesday. The network is funded by the World Health Organization. The most recent United Nations statistics show that almost 1.2 million people were killed on the world's roads in 1998, Hyder said. In 1998 more than one million of the world's road accident victims were in Africa, Asia, South and Central America and regions like the former Soviet Union. By 2020, road accidents will be the third leading cause of death, behind heart disease and deaths linked to mental illness, Hyder said. The WHO definition of deaths linked to mental illness includes degenerative conditions like Alzheimer's disease, suicides by people suffering from depression and alcohol abuse. Governments - especially in poor countries - must find new ways to reduce the carnage, he said. Most of the accidents occur in developing countries where western-style traffic regulations are largely ineffective because they are rarely enforced or because people and vehicles have to share the same busy roads. "Two-thirds of the people who die are pedestrians," Hyder told reporters. "People who will never own a car in their life are at the greatest risk." Most road safety studies are produced in rich countries and their lessons may not be appropriate for the developing world, he said. Clamping down on people who fail to wear a seat belt, for example, can be much less effective in some countries than "separating the space" so pedestrians and cyclists do not have to travel alongside cars or buses, he said. http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20020830/traffic_accidents_020830/Health/story/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 13:24:02 -0600 (CST) From: "E. John Wilson" Subject: re: Unsolicited Letter from RFC Kingston I for one totally agree with the sentiment expressed by Mr. James Shepherd, we all have a common goal therefor we should unite to achieve our goal... John ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2002 15:42:15 -0600 (CST) From: The Jordans Subject: VictTC: Ottawa looks for ways to intercept e-mails Ottawa looks for ways to intercept e-mails Concerns for privacy raised as security agencies and police seek Internet access Jim Bronskill - Times Colonist (Victoria) Friday, August 30, 2002 OTTAWA -- New legislative proposals would pave the way for Canadian police and spies to routinely intercept e-mail messages, changes that could bolster the fight against crime and terrorism but weaken privacy for Internet users and cause financial headaches for service providers. The initiative is part of a plan, outlined in a federal consultation paper, to require all communication service providers -- including traditional telephone companies, wireless firms and Internet providers -- to ensure there are no technical barriers to police and security agencies seeking access to messages or conversations. The surveillance plan represents the latest effort by federal security officials to prevent terrorists and other criminals from using modern communication devices to shield their dealings. The Justice Department paper also suggests new rules requiring communication companies to produce information, such as a customer's name and address, within a certain time frame. Other potential changes would compel firms to establish a national database of customer contact information, as well as preserve data of potential interest to authorities. The paper says rapidly evolving communication technologies "pose a significant challenge" to security agencies since they can be used in the "planning, co-ordination, financing and perpetration of crimes" and threats to public safety. Current Criminal Code provisions appear to allow police and security agencies, with approval from a judge, to intercept e-mail messages in certain instances. However, the paper indicates the state of the law dealing with "private communication" is somewhat unclear when it comes to cyberspace traffic. It suggests a specific new Criminal Code amendment spelling out how an e-mail should be acquired and the procedural safeguards needed to protect Canadians. The provision, along with the other changes outlined in the paper, would permit Canada to ratify the Council of Europe Convention on Cyber-Crime, an international treaty that calls for criminalization of several computer-related offences and creation of new tools to help authorities police them. The desire to bring Canada in line with the treaty is not a good enough reason to push ahead with the changes in the consultation paper, some of which could prove to be very invasive for e-mail users, said Michael Geist, a University of Ottawa law professor. "I don't know that they've provided a strong enough justification to show that the problem exists," Geist said Thursday. Under the proposal on interception of messages, all communication providers would be required to provide "a basic intercept capability" when providing new services to the public. The consultation paper indicates companies would be responsible for the costs of any new equipment needed to ensure agencies such as the RCMP and the Canadian Security Intelligence Service have access to messages or phone conversations. However, the paper hints that firms would not have to bear the financial burden of upgrading existing systems. Jay Thomson, president of the Canadian Association of Internet Providers, said he wants to see more information about the proposals. "Right now, they're ideas without details," said Thomson, whose members provide more than 85 per cent of the Internet connections to Canadian homes, schools, and businesses. "We obviously would have concerns about how much it's going to cost, and who's going to bear those costs. We also have concerns about what the potential obligations could mean for our customers and their right to privacy." The Justice Department is accepting public comment on the consultation paper until Nov. 15. © Copyright 2002 Times Colonist (Victoria) http://www.canada.com/victoria/timescolonist/story.asp?id={165B9EF4-C689-4932-8227-1EB77D4D8A14} ------------------------------ End of Cdn-Firearms Digest V5 #7 ******************************** Submissions: mailto:cdn-firearms-digest@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Mailing List Commands: mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca Moderator's e-mail address: mailto:acardin33@shaw.ca List owner: mailto:owner-cdn-firearms@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca FAQ list: http://www.magma.ca/~asd/cfd-faq1.html and http://teapot.usask.ca/cdn-firearms/Faq/cfd-faq1.html Web Site: http://teapot.usask.ca/cdn-firearms/homepage.html FTP Site: ftp://teapot.usask.ca/pub/cdn-firearms/ CFDigest Archives: http://www.sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca/~ab133/ or put the next command in an e-mail message and mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca get cdn-firearms-digest v04.n192 end (192 is the digest issue number and 04 is the volume) To unsubscribe from _all_ the lists, put the next five lines in a message and mailto:majordomo@sfn.saskatoon.sk.ca unsubscribe cdn-firearms-digest unsubscribe cdn-firearms-alert unsubscribe cdn-firearms-chat unsubscribe cdn-firearms end (To subscribe, use "subscribe" instead of "unsubscribe".) 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